Dustin Howes: 0:26

Hey folks, dustin O's here, your nerderator of the day on Affiliate Nerd Out. We're here spreading that good word about affiliate marketing. My guest today Todd Wiseman, ceo and owner of pubrecruitercom. Come and join me and Nerd Out about publisher recruitment and everything else. If you enjoy our show and you want to be a guest of mine, come click this QR code or go to dustinhousecom and sign up to be in the Nerditorium. Todd, welcome, great to have you here, bud.

Todd Weitzman: 1:08

Thanks, dustin, great to be here and hello every affiliate nerd out there.

Dustin Howes: 1:15

Awesome. I met Todd at Affiliate Summit years ago and so we hit it off, and through the years he's been a great affiliate manager in this industry and been connected with him a long time, so we're going to talk about what he's doing over at pubrecruiter. If you have any questions about affiliate marketing and you want to jump in, feel free to drop it in the chat below, but without further ado. Todd, who are you?

Todd Weitzman: 1:46

I get that question a lot. Actually my wife asked that too. No well for me. I've been in the affiliate industry 10 years. Started out at a cashback website. Won't name drop because I don't know if they still exist or not.

Dustin Howes: 2:03

Or if anybody liked them. I won't say the latter.

Todd Weitzman: 2:10

But yeah, I worked there, got my bearings in affiliate, learned to kind of pet the power behind working with brands, seeing the performance roll in. Before that I worked as many different digital types of opportunities and even going back further, working at a pawn shop. So I know all the powers of negotiation and the affiliate channel kind of it works with that. In a sense you do use negotiation. And from there I went to an affiliate network, worked with different partners and advertisers, worked at several affiliate agencies, large and small, so currently working with a brand directly Liberty Tax. But I also have built out a recruitment platform called pubrecruitercom which I built myself, and it really helps solve the problem of publisher recruitment and that initial outreach.

Dustin Howes: 3:13

Awesome, fantastic. I put Todd's link to his LinkedIn profile in the chat. Jump on it. While you're in that chat, why don't you drop out a little line and hassle us a little bit? What over here is a Philly fan. Everybody knows I'm a Giants Homer Drop baseball drop affiliate. We don't care, we can take it. Todd, let's talk about pubrecruiter. I didn't realize you built it out. What was that process like? For? Well, let's start with what pubrecruitercom is first. What does it do?

Todd Weitzman: 3:49

Yeah, so pubrecruiter is a dashboard in the sense you sign up as a brand or a partner or a publisher whatever verbage you use and you sign up and you get access to multiple opportunities. So if you're a publisher, you get and you see multiple opportunities for brands, and then vice versa, so if you're a brand, you get access to see multiple publishers and partners within the affiliate space. It's strictly affiliate, so you're not going to see a ton of content partners, you're going to see strictly affiliate. You're going to see content partners as well blogs, anything that touches really the affiliate tracking industry. Yeah, and it really makes it simple to reach out to these partners, get the initial outreach going. So that's the gist of it.

Dustin Howes: 4:48

Okay, great. What do you charge brands or publishers to be on this platform?

Todd Weitzman: 4:56

Well, right now it's 100% free, so you can sign up. It's free to get going. I built it on the side and really it's there for you to kind of find new partners. Right now it's free. I can't say that it will be down the road, as I'm looking to launch it possibly into a business, but anyone who signs up now will be grandfathered in. So you do get access to the dashboard, the Chrome extension, which also works when you hop onto a partner website. You do get contact information. You can send outreach directly from the Chrome extension, which is patent pending also.

Dustin Howes: 5:39

I just want to throw that out. So you add a Chrome extension onto this. And what about you? Did you build this out yourself, or did you hire developers to go and do this stuff?

Todd Weitzman: 5:53

Yeah, so it's a bit of both. I do know a bit of HTML light JavaScript, but I built the frameworks myself and then I did hire a freelancer for the development of everything else.

Dustin Howes: 6:08

So yeah, Great, it looks like we got somebody interested already in here. Maria says that does it find new targeted affiliates?

Todd Weitzman: 6:21

It doesn't a sense. So when you sign up, let's say you're a brand and you're in the finance space, we will tag you as a finance brand and then you get access to finance partners. But once you're in the dashboard, you can see any partner within the platform. There are also some hidden ones in there, so I kind of restrict them. Some partners want their information private, which makes sense for them, same with the brands. So we also have a portion where I can recommend partners for you. That's like that agency-like solution that I was possibly looking to build out. But, yeah, you get targeted partners that you may already work with, but also possibly ones you don't.

Dustin Howes: 7:11

Okay, excellent. Well, looks like Maria is in for it. She's going to go give it a try and it's just pubrecruitercom, right.

Todd Weitzman: 7:21

Hubrecreatercom. You'll see create your free profile. You select if you're a brand or a creator and go from there.

Dustin Howes: 7:28

Fantastic, all right, and so you're servicing both brands and publishers in there. Everybody creates their own profile and it's just like a networking hub. I just absolutely love communities like this that are, you know, passing around information to get more exposure on both ends of the circuit. So love what you're doing over there with this.

Todd Weitzman: 7:50

I appreciate that. Yeah, I mean that's really the goal of it is kind of De-segmentizing. I know, like with affiliate, there's lots of networks, there's lots of agencies, partners, brands kind of want to make sure there's Sort of that singular place where you can go to and know for sure that when you're reaching out to a partner it gets to the right person.

Todd Weitzman: 8:14

That's kind of what I'm trying to do here. You know I went went to affiliate summit, which we might, may talk to you about later, but one of the questions that keeps coming up is what's the best way to reach out to a brand, what's the best way to reach out to a publisher? That's kind of what the problem. I'm looking at and saying to myself okay, how can I miss make pub recruiter that kind of solution for the affiliate channel? Or, you know, brands or partners really want to use that platform.

Dustin Howes: 8:42

Yeah, absolutely.

Dustin Howes: 8:44

And you know I've been working with a lot of CRM slash recruitment tools like Media rails and Grovia over the years and everything Kind of either goes out of date because they don't keep updating the data base or something falls behind, like in technology, and and it just stops working.

Dustin Howes: 9:11

But If you've got a platform that isn't necessarily, you know, built to Stay with the times, that that's like the recipe for disaster and where it ends eventually. But I love what you're doing here as self-service, like fill it out, your information is up to date so that people can find you. But one of those really interesting portions of using tools like this is not abusing it for for automation like it was really easy for me to grind down a list of target affiliates with Grovia and try to batch and blast an email out to all of them about the brand that I was working with, and that really never turned out to be a good Solution or response rate, if you will. So what are some of those best practices you see as like using your tool, but also like doing a little bit of personalization after you find the right contact?

Todd Weitzman: 10:19

Yeah, I mean that's you hit the nail on the head there.

Todd Weitzman: 10:22

I mean that's that's the key focus of what I'm trying to build is like I want to make public recruiter the destination to reach the person, but also make sure that the brands are reputable as well so that when it does reach, you know, you know the publication, that they know that they're, you know they have marketing spend or they have affiliate performance behind their their reputation.

Todd Weitzman: 10:48

So I know that's important for the publisher side. I've heard them say that themselves. So really it's, it's a solution that kind of Will solve that on its own when it's restricted to certain brands, which it isn't now but it will be eventually. I'm looking for, you know, other ways to approach these brands and the messaging that when a brand does reach out to a partner, that messaging is very authentic and concise so that when the partner does get notified from pub recruiter, they know it's a good opportunity. That's really the key is that when partners see of that pub recruiter notification, they know it's a really good opportunity. It makes their job easier, it makes the brand's job easier so they can, you know, go out and play some baseball.

Dustin Howes: 11:44

All right, so you, actually you can Contact each other from within the, the platform.

Todd Weitzman: 11:53

That's no. Well, that's not a function yet. I've considered that. But really it's the initial outreach, so it is strictly Notification through the app, the Chrome extension or the dashboard, and then also it goes to their email. So, whatever the proper email is that you sign up, that's the one that you'll see within the dashboard and that's what the partners will see as well.

Dustin Howes: 12:16

Fantastic, okay, and it looks like Maria is still interested in this. Is it only for the finance vertical? Pretty sure it isn't. Tell us what vertical it is for.

Todd Weitzman: 12:29

Well, I have a lot of experience within the finance vertical, but it's open to the whole affiliate channel. So anyone who really has touched the affiliate tracking that's the goals kind of getting them within the platform Typically they should have some performance or a good audience. When you're a brand that signs up, you do get basic metrics. So you'll see, you know let's say, upsell it, for example you'll see how many you know Traffic they get through similar web, all the data from similar web. So you'll see like a hundred K Viewers or something along those lines. Just adding that validity to these Affiliate partners, you kind of see what they bring to the table.

Dustin Howes: 13:10

Awesome, and so you're pulling in data from similar web. You getting like domain authority and what their capabilities are. That's awesome, super helpful, especially on my end. Like trying to find potential and affiliates can be really difficult, but Seeing what a domain authority is and what traffic capabilities are super helpful, so that's a great feature there. So so, on the lines of keeping it personal, what's been working for you? You're you're still an active recruitment specialist for the company you're working for. I love this topic so much. Anything to improve my response rate on emails for the clients I'm working for it's always helpful. What's working for you right now? Thank you for watching. I hope you enjoyed this video.

Todd Weitzman: 14:05

Yeah, that's the great question and for me. I started way back when I worked for an affiliate network recruiting partners. I did a lot of trial and error and that's where a lot of my inspiration comes to PubRecruiter.

Todd Weitzman: 14:23

But, I think it's a great topic, really. So when are you starting out young? You're thinking, okay, let me just pitch this brand and use as many words as possible, highlight all this information and then show it to the partner. That doesn't work. So, really, what it works for the partner is let's make a deal. This goes back when I worked as a pawnbroker back in the day.

Dustin Howes: 14:49

How do we?

Todd Weitzman: 14:50

kind of bridge the gap between two people. You're actually talking to somebody in a sense. So, really being concise, maybe one to two sentences. If you're a network professional, if you're working for an affiliate network, maybe recruiting partners highlight the top brands that work with your affiliate network. You work with, let's say, acorns thinking of another US bank, and then this really small bank that no one's ever heard of, kind of throw that in there. So it's kind of like adding these different brands of different magnitudes. One might stick, but showcasing this unique brand kind of adds that additional I want to say validity to the email. You want to be concise I mean that's the real end goal here One to two sentences, because you're reaching someone who's very busy, gets a ton of emails that's really what PubRecruiter has literally one to two emails. I highlight what the brand is, their vertical, if they've done business before, what they're interested in, and that's really just getting in and getting out because they're busy and you're busy as well.

Todd Weitzman: 16:16

You want to give that thought that you're busy as well, hunting different opportunities. You want to make it work for both sides and the partner knows that they know what works for them. They have a list perhaps of already current working partners and brands that they've worked with. So if you're approaching as a new opportunity, you want to maybe compare yourself or showcase already working promotions or content pieces that they can best. Maybe it'll cost more, but you just want to be concise as possible.

Dustin Howes: 17:01

Yeah, great points in there. I always say that long emails are going to be the death of you if you're trying to recruit affiliates. So making it over five sentences long is going to dramatically drop your response rate. So be concise, get to the point. One of my favorite newest tactics I learned from Patty McGill not too long ago, who opened his email with cat references and just getting my attention. Just playing around being goofy and using your own personality has been extremely helpful for me to get responses playing around with. You got to excite them a little bit in some kind of capacity so you can elicit a response of some sort. So great points in there Now being that you get a hold of them and now you got them into your program. Let's talk about the partnership tactics. What's been working for you here Is your mode to like. You got to hold up a really nice affiliate. Are you trying to get them on a call and if you are, do you continue to have some kind of cadence with them in the future?

Todd Weitzman: 18:23

Yeah, great question. I think the affiliate partnership again goes two ways. You got to look at it, what's working for them? Because they're looking at you and they're looking at other brands potentially and there are possibly better opportunities for that. So the key when you're looking for a new partnership is to test, looking for that initial test opportunity. Find it, however it may be.

Todd Weitzman: 18:52

You want to be as specific as possible. You want to be a part of, let's say, a gifting article, a listicle that you know has worked. You looked up the SEO perhaps, or the ranking on the page. You want to be a part of that. So that might cost initial upfront spend. So you might want to inquire about that, see how much it is. If that works. You want to test it out, see if it works. If it doesn't, move on to the next opportunity.

Todd Weitzman: 19:26

You want to be as agile as possible, because the affiliate channel is about working partnerships. It's not about partnerships that don't work. So testing is a huge thing and you want to test with the right guys. That's sort of what PubRecruiter helps with. But you do want to test efficiently. You want to pick and choose wisely so you don't bleed your channel dry For sure. But yeah, testing is super important because you might find one opportunity that can turn around your whole affiliate program. I have seen it before, or I have seen many programs be too reliant on a singular partner and it just never ends well.

Dustin Howes: 20:17

Oh, so true, and diversifying your portfolio affiliates is extremely important and it just emphasizes the necessity of recruitment. To continue to recruit, no matter how good your program is. Don't just chill out Like you can't chill out as an affiliate manager or you are going to lose somebody. I like to say my top 10 affiliates. I'm trying to get on a phone call with them once a month, at least once a quarter, to check in on them and see how they are doing and see what else I can do to provide help and assistance for them to be better. But I don't know if you follow that same cadence. It might be a little bit more difficult when you are working as an agency or consulting as well, because time is precious throughout the day. But if you have somebody internally that can handle those calls, it's a good practice to have.

Todd Weitzman: 21:18

Yeah, I agree, and I think I have some similar cadence to that. I have contacts of different personal finance brands that I keep in touch with. For me it's more personal, as you mentioned we talked about baseball earlier the Giants and Phillies but several other partners more so relate to them on a personal level, because this whole channel and this whole industry is really about relationships, growing those. We might not be at the same job at X point than the Y point, but usually if you are in the affiliate channel, you stay within it because it's a unique opportunity, it's a unique career, because I think it goes back to because you pay on performance. I think that's really the driver for a lot of interest in the channel. Because of that it's much more efficient and easier to approach seniors and get promoted, because it's very easy to show performance.

Dustin Howes: 23:19

Oh, very true. Now, going back to you making that point on my Personally, like having that kind of connection and us talking baseball, like that's gonna go in my notes for Todd. Like I have my own personal CRM where I keep track of all of my relationships. And Little notes like that go a long way because every time I get on a phone call, you know if I get on my next call with Todd two years from now I'm gonna have that little node. But he's a Philly's fan. I can make fun of how bad his team is, or and and bust his chops there. So really great point highlighting.

Dustin Howes: 24:03

You know the use of a CRM is extraordinarily important. As an affiliate manager and Every company that you work with, you should be essentially taking the affiliates that you've been working with and have them in your own personal database for the future Super valuable as you continue to grow in this industry and work your way up, whatever your journey may be. Arun says I want to try this tool. If it's worth that, I'm ready to write a review about it on my group. Fantastic, great Arun, that would be wonderful. I'm sure Todd can reciprocate with Something outside of money. It's a free product right now, but in the future that might be great real estate when he does end up monetizing it and Building his own affiliate program for it. So good, good on you, jump in there, public recruiter, calm, check it out. All right, let's transition a little bit to when you just we're going to affiliate summit and I I Heard you went is that right that it was? It was short-lived.

Todd Weitzman: 25:24

Yeah, I went for a couple hours. I don't want to say I went in and went out, but you know I did check out the meat market. You know, when you go to these affiliate summits, you know one out of three I find to be very, very useful. This wasn't one of those three, unfortunately, but I did attend a couple of content commerce sessions which I found to be Informative, certainly as a brand manager, as the operator of pub recruiter. For me the meat market always has different vendors not particularly related to the traditional affiliate channel. These usually some interesting ones that you know probably won't work for me so, but you know it might work for someone else. For me I've been to multiple affiliate summits. I don't like traveling too much to New York City.

Todd Weitzman: 26:24

I'm not far away from New York, but I Prefer the Vegas one, but it is a far traveling place.

Dustin Howes: 26:31

Yeah, I Love me some Vegas. I try to stay away from the New York City one. It is a a long journey and I think most of my friends know my my feelings on New York City in general. So but How'd you end up going there? So it was short lived, but I heard, I heard about how you got that ticket. How'd you get that ticket?

Todd Weitzman: 26:56

Yeah, so I belong to the PMA. They give a free pass, essentially for for myself. So I did attend. I'm certainly worth it. I mean even in the two hours or so that I was there possibly more, more hours but I did find it. You know, even that short amount of time is worth investing in it because you still might find that opportunity that you know could change your affiliate program. There's also just a good amount of people there that are good people that know the industry really well. I met you there a couple years ago. Yeah, you know, there's always people there worthy of a good conversation. You just have to Book in advance. I want to say use the app. You know you do get a lot of requests through the app that just make no sense. Just want to throw that out.

Dustin Howes: 27:54

Yeah, yeah, and even if you don't go to the conference, the PMA is gonna give you that free ticket to affiliate summit West, affiliate summit East. Sign up, take the ticket and then just use the app for Networking. You can go out there and and have some really good campaigns Showcasing what your product is or to join your affiliate program. You don't even necessarily go to the conference, but you can utilize their app. I've had incredible success gaining a ton of meetings through their app every single session. Just just utilize it and the PMAorg fantastic community. But they also give tickets to the conferences away for free. Because they get these tickets and and it comes with your membership. Membership is pretty cheap. What do you? What are you paying Todd like $200?.

Todd Weitzman: 28:53

Exactly yeah.

Dustin Howes: 28:54

Yeah, cheap. It pays for itself every single year that I continue to be a member of this organization, so absolutely love it. Now, conference life I like to say every conference that I go to in my network I like to make 10 new acquaintances where these are people that I'm shaking hands with for the first time and saying hi to, and then I make one really lifetime friend and that's most likely somebody that I wasn't acquaintance with before but I really got to have more intimate conversation with them and they become lifetime friends and we're getting close to that, that status here, todd, we're getting into that, but I always like having that in mind. Do you have anything in mind when you're going to conference, like as some kind of set goal?

Todd Weitzman: 29:55

Yeah, I mean, I think the goal is really to find the unique partners that you've never heard of before. But have that value.

Todd Weitzman: 30:03

And that goes with my experience working in personal finance. There's always these FinTech apps that's what we call them that just have like this really unique business proposition. Like acorns, you save that extra penny and it goes into your stock portfolio. What is an affiliate? You never heard of that, just kind of you know, intrigues you in a sense. That could be that partner that drives performance and they'll likely show up at these conferences, likely not talking to too many people. They're a brand new opportunity. I want to be a part of that kind of keep an eye out for those kind of the partners. That's one aspect, I think, for me, meeting with current partners, whether it's here working at public recruiter or if I'm working brand directly as a job, you know, meet with your current partners, usually the affiliate space. You're not really talking to them directly as much so the affiliate summit is a good place to meet.

Dustin Howes: 31:14

That's another aspect. And for those of you that go to conferences and know the value of them, they can be absolutely great but they can also be expensive like it can be a tough route. And if you want to go get that education but you don't want to pay for an entire trip, for tickets, hotels, go to performancemarketingmanagercom and take my online course. It teaches everything you need to know about running an affiliate program and much, much more. Everything that I have learned over the past 13 years about affiliate marketing, partnership marketing and best practices I pounded into this course and it comes with a community as well, so you can join in and get a bunch of other affiliate managers. And so, moving on from that sponsor of the day, I've got a long time listener. Great guest Wade Tonkin, industry legend. How large is the publisher base in your tool currently? Great question.

Todd Weitzman: 32:29

Great question. I appreciate it. I know who you are, by the way. No, I'm just kidding, I do. But you know, the publisher base is modest, I want to say, but also there are several hidden partners in the, in the platform. So, what you see, there is a decent amount, but there's also several that have chosen not to keep their profile active or not active visible. So I can recommend those. If you join the platform as a brand, you still get access to those and it's free to join. So the publisher group is going to be growing from here on out, and so I'm going to go ahead and share the message and, as I mentioned, the dust and early it's only. It could just be about one partner that turns your, your whole affiliate program around, or that is a free performance that you want to show your stakeholders that they're always never happy.

Todd Weitzman: 33:28

If you're working as a brand manager, they're almost always looking for a performance increases, whether it's week over week or month over month. That's the kind of tool I wanted to be to kind of help. You know brand managers like ways or whoever it may be the lesson, their play, in a sense, so that they can focus on on their current partners or work with these new partners that I helped bring to the table.

Dustin Howes: 33:54

For sure Wade is. He has a history of being the nicest guy in this industry and I don't say that lightly, I really believe it. And Wade is always giving his time to companies just like yours that are early on and he wants to give that feedback to make it a better tool for the future. He's done it with a ton of companies. Wade, thanks for jumping in and saying hi, appreciate you Switching gears a little bit Marketing trends. What are you seeing out there that's working. I know you like this topic and wanted to talk about it, so what have you got?

Todd Weitzman: 34:38

Yeah, I mean for me. You know, when I look at new partnerships, you know I keep an eye out for new publishers in the space. Obviously, being public recruiter, I try to find new trends and new potential partners in the space. You do see a lot of influencer based affiliates, so that's something I'm kind of looking into. I'm not fully committed to the influencer channel quite yet. I just think that it's more so upfront spend versus what really drives the affiliate channel, which is performance. So I'm not against it, but I think a lot of stakeholders want that influencer slash, affiliate hybrid kind of thing where they're looking for those new partners in the influencer space.

Dustin Howes: 35:35

Yeah and I think the industry is moving towards that right like influencers drank this Kool-Aid that they can only take on sponsorships years back and I think they're evolving into into more hybrid state and and I have some really big influencers with hundreds of thousands of followers and subscribers that are working off a strictly CPA basis still like they know the value and they they ask for an increase in CPA, of course, which I don't give to hybrids. They get the base level or even less, but I want skin in the game with those influencers and I think that industry is coming around.

Todd Weitzman: 36:20

Finally, yeah, well, that would be great because I think they have a lot of power in introducing new products and I think that has a lot of value to the affiliate channel. I think that's where influencers need to have focus on. You know, because you're looking at tick tock and you're seeing a very blatant sponsor, dad, and it doesn't have anything to do with the influencer. It could be the worst thing you've ever paid for the.

Todd Weitzman: 36:49

ROI would be dreadful as opposed to a performance based listicle or something like that, and you're based on that as affiliate managers, and so it's certainly an educational aspect. I would agree to that. I think a lot of influencers do not know affiliate and a lot of stakeholders don't know affiliate. I think the main push For me that always seems to work is that you're paying for performance, so no money out of their pockets until there's a sale, and that to me, is like the best like thing you can say to like a stakeholder, because, like when you're paying for paid search, for example, it can, you can have a click and you're paying 20 bucks for it, but it never ends up as a sale. You're gonna spend a lot of money on that, or Social ads as well. So Facebook I've heard it is not doing as well or meta.

Todd Weitzman: 37:47

I should say meta.

Dustin Howes: 37:48

Yeah, x is gonna be just fine, though Wade says there are some affiliates out there who would argue otherwise. Well, yeah, everybody's, don't make Wade Denny like Don't, don't bite the hand that feed you as an affiliate. You need to make friends in this industry and if you're gonna do things that are a little black hat or even gray hat area, be transparent about it, or else Wade's gonna find you and and take away your commissions Awesome. Last thing I want to think is defending your post. Looks I, I I trolled through your LinkedIn. I found something. I want you to defend yourself. Hot take about a massive layoff round Going on. If it's happening to you, it's a darn good chance of a happen to you again. Protect yourself and become the stakeholder, not the stake holder. I love it. Start a business or specialized in your industry to lend your post here. Man, what do you? What are you trying to say?

Todd Weitzman: 38:56

Yeah, I mean, I totally agree with that. Still, it's it's something I drive me every day. I Think it just goes with experience. You know, not everyone's like Wade, who has been with the comp said company for a while, but I think when you're starting a new, whether you're young in this economic climate or Whether you're very experienced, I think starting a business is sort of a way to protect yourself, and you have experience. A lot of people are more afraid to start a business because they might not have anything to offer or it's a big leap in a sense For me. You know you don't have any control when you're working for someone else, so being an entrepreneur or starting something on the side Is a way to kind of keep yourself safe. It doesn't work for everybody, obviously. You know you need to take that risk, but it's a risk worth taking. I've started multiple businesses that have not worked, but I still Say I still believe in that because same boat.

Todd Weitzman: 40:05

Yeah, yeah, I've worked at agencies. That where I started. And then the cove it in the economy happened. You know, got buck. Oh, you know you, you never control these things. So you want to put yourself in a position to control your future.

Dustin Howes: 40:24

Excellent, well said, building your own brand for yourself and going out there and trying something to be a game-changer is something I'm right, or striving to do, if you will. And and Entrepreneurship isn't for everybody, like Some people will go and go after that gold watch. Wade's been with oh Fanatics for I don't know 15 plus years, I think he said. But he's you know, he's got a constant paycheck there's, there's real merit and in Stability like that. But that's not my lifestyle, that's not your lifestyle. Like we're out there dreaming and coming up with new products and Trying to push that envelope there and If that is you as well, like, start today. If you don't like your status quo of having a consistent job or where you're working, go out and try to build something for yourself. Love that message that you're you're spreading around there. Thanks for sharing there, todd.

Todd Weitzman: 41:31

Yeah, I appreciate it.

Dustin Howes: 41:32

Yeah, you got it All right. Well, as we wind down my guests next week it's gonna be Wesley Wheaton and tricky Ricky Guinness there Coming in and joining me. If you would like to be a guest, just like Todd, hit this QR code right here or go to dustinhousecom slash nerd, give me your best pitch for why you want to be in the nerd atorium with me and, lastly, if you would like a free 15 minute call with me, go to dustinhousecom slash explore and let's hang out. Todd, really appreciate you being here. Buddy, any last words before we go.

Todd Weitzman: 42:14

Yeah, no, I think. Thanks for having me, dustin. It was great chatting with you and you know, fellow nerd, just keep Grinding, finding new Opportunities within the channel for yourself or the brand you're working with, or, if you're a publisher, have an open mind on new partnerships.

Dustin Howes: 42:32

Open mind, great message, great way to finish that out. All right, folks, we'll see you out there, take care.